I agree that CR should be giving their noise ratings in decibels!.  I am currently looking for a new window unit with low indoor noise levela, as it is in a family room.  I just got rid of a 3 year old Frigidaire 10,000 btu unit because I couldn't stand the noise for another season. I am going to try a Samsung unit & if that is too noisy I will spring for a Friedrich unit dispite the expense.  How about changing your methods CR?

Folks,

Like I said before, we call em like we see em. We buy samples from stores just like you and test them.  Our noise judgement is a measurement of the noise plus a subjective ingredient of how annoying the noise is; and we present it in a way that's digestible for the reader. If your experience doesn't agree with our finding, the difference may be due to a defect or how it was mounted, does it resonate with the window you have it installed, and so on.

"Listing decibels is not an option as the vast majority of readers would fully understand that."

It's not that difficult to understand.

"we present it in a way that's digestible for the reader."

Perhaps CR is underestimating the intelligence of it's readership?

Instead of dumbing down the ratings, why don't you upgrade the ratings, and better educate the consumer in the process? It seems to me that education should be part of  your mission.

CR's subjective ratings continue to fail us. You can't test for every conceivable circumstance, but you can demystify those circles and start providing us with more complete quantified data. This isn't about just appliances, it's CR review of cars, tires, everything.

Hi

I agree they should review in decibles. I have the same trouble and have purchased a brand new unit for the last 3 years. I didnt care how much it cost as long as the noise level was low. I purchased The sharp and Fredrich and Frigedare and they were all so noisy and very heavy units to lift into a window. The Samsung was a great unit. The only problem with the Samsung was that at High fan speed it barely sent any air out, otherwise it was a wonderful unit. Hope that helps you a little.

re noisy air conditioners: Exactly what would we not understand if decibel ratings were included in the review. What makes your review have even less value is the addition of "subjective" ingredients of noise quality. Isn't it possible that others might not share your same subjective opinion. Why not stay objective and let your readers decide?

To the staff at CR:

I am in the market for a quiet window unit AC.  I was drawn to CR for it's objective and methodical reviews.  The huge disparity between the consumer reviews and the CR reviews casts doubt on the efficacy of your entire review process.  Especially see the Frigidaire FAA067P7A.  If there is a such a large discrepancy and there are so many hits to this thread you should try to address the issue of noise and window units.  What are the installation issues?  Are there variations in the manufacturing?  Is regional climate a factor?  Can the consumer or a technician apply lubrication?  Just shrugging is not an answer and does not respond to the mission of the organization.

I certainly would not consider extending my subscription if this issue remains unaddressed.

Kennith,

The forum represents a small segment of people who have bought a product. Those who have had problems are also much more likely to vent thier frustrations with it. If you look at our brand reliability tables, even if 5% of folks have problems with them, that is still a very large number. We don't guarantee if a product is top rated, it will not have any lemons. Our brand ratings give you an idea of the odds of getting a lemon.

Hi

I've relied on CR reviews for many years, and I have to say that in general, room air conditioners have become more flimsy and noisy than in years past.   It's unfortunate that Panasonic stopped making them too.    I bought a few air conditioners only to be unhappy with the purchase.   I have a Friedrich Quietmaster Programmable 14,000BTU a/c and not only was it noisy (cabinet vibrated, and the in general wasn't that quiet) but the fan has slowed considerably (I think it needs a lube job) and the vent lever has since broken.   Not what I'd expect from a $700+ unit.    I also purchased the top rated GE air conditioner for the bedroom.  It is quiet, if I could get the cabinet from and side panels from making noise too.     It's too bad my old 7800btu Panasonic couldn't do the job in my larger apartment now.   

I see no reason that CR can not list the noise in their reports in sones.  

Mr. Mannino,
I'm just beginning my search for a quiet window air conditioning unit.  I haven't even looked at  your report, yet, but I assure you, I was hoping to see a decibel comparison of the brands you reviewed.  No one needs to be an engineer to appreciate the value of objective criteria.  Really. 

I would love to see a comparison for interior noise between today's low-cost window air conditioners versus window air conditioners from the early '60s. I used to service A/C in the late '70s and early '80s. We would see units from Fedders, Philco and GE that, when running well and installed correctly, were almost SILENT indoors. (We actually tied ribbons on the air outlets of some Philco and GE units so we wouldn't forget to turn them off when leaving a building - there was no way to tell the blower was on by listening to them.) The secret (no secret really) was heavy construction (especially the barrier between the inside and outside) and large blower boxes. Larger blowers work more quietly when trying to do the same job as a smaller blower. But, a 7000 BTU window air conditioner bullt this way weighs well over 100 pounds, and has a 26 inch wide cabinet, so there are windows they won't fit and people who don't like lifting them.

Back then, a window A/C was a luxury product, and manufacturers could afford to put the best materials in them. Now, they are commodities that are built to the lowest price because a manufacturer doing anything else will go out of business. Does anyone remember these fine units from that "golden age"?

Mr. Mannino,

I am trying to buy an air conditioner for my daughter's room. I bought a Maytag model M6X06F2A-F three and a half years ago and it is incredibly noisy (induced structural vibration.) I am disappointed that your ratings do not include any quantitative noise information. As a licensed engineer, I know that there are ways of moderating the noise levels that a vibrating mechanism can produce or induce into a structure and I am sure that some manufacturer out there has done a better job. If you have qualified people on your staff who can understand this you would do a great service by finding and publicizing such information. If you do not, some of us would clearly appreciate future changes in this direction.

Then don't get a Whirpool 24,500 BTU because it is terribly noisey.  It's in a really big room so now I'm looking for a smaller BTU and quieter.  My mother has a GE unit that's 24,000BTU and it is wonderful.  So very quiet.  I wish the stores would have one of each they sell plugged in so you could hear it.  I realize it might sound different in your home but at least it would give you an idea of how loud it would be.

Stanley, I totally remember these units, as I was one of the fortunate one's to live with grandparents and then my parents who looked at air conditioners as a necessity.   My grandparents had the original Fedders a/c, the one with the big wheel in front and that sucker was HEAVY.  They lived in a four room, top floor of a New York apartment and these 3 air conditioners cooled that apartment perfectly!   Then, one broke and they got an Emerson QUiet Kool.   Again, probably not more than 7,000 btu and they used a zillion watts of electricity.    We had Emerson QK's and a Fedders...also... very quiet, but the one's I really remember as being quiet were the Philco's.   Actually, the Philco called themselves "Noiseless"!   Remember that one?      THe funny thing is that my parents also had a 4 room apartment, had a 5 a 6 and a 7,000 btu a/c which, when all were on, cooled the apartment.    Today, I need a 14,000 in the living room and a 6,000 in the bedroom to do the same cooling job as the earlier ones.   Even though they used more energy, they really did seem to do a superior job for less cooling capacity, were quieter and dehumidified better too!    Is this my imagination?

Ben

I also feel that decibel levels are essential. They allow for objective comparison and would be a check against manufacturers claims. Subjective assessments are also useful, though, so why not include both since niose is the malor issue for so many people especially in sleeping
situations.

I would also like to see new ratings for the portable units as so many are now on the market due to dissallowance of window units and the (often) necessity of needing more than one, since they are not portable.

Measurements in dB levels could easily be compared to a chart showing everyday noises that people are familiar with and could serve as a general reference.  With the Internet as a resource, I'm sure your average reader could gain enough knowledge of decibels to find CR lab measurements in db's very useful when searching for an AC unit with a tolerable noise level.

For example, these comparative figures are found in FAA documents dealing with noise abatement:

EXAMPLES OF EVERYDAY NOISE
? Car passing 25’ away is 77 dB
? Diesel truck 50’ away is 84 dB
? Passenger car is 70 dB
? Train averages 85 dB
? Motorcycle 25’ away is 90 dB
? Power mower is 96 dB
? Food blender is 88 dB
? Garbage disposal is 80 dB
? Conversation is 60 dB
? Living room music, TV-audio, vacuum cleaner; each is 76 dB

I have been a CR reader for many years and review your test results for nearly every purchase I make. I do have to say that I think your responses here are a little overly defensive. Most readers are simply making suggestions on how your data could be more useful to your subscribers.  Please consider it as "constructive criticism" instead of negative feedback.

Ben: The noise levels of these old units were definitely lower. I had a few Philco units and serviced several in my day, and they were incredibly quiet inside, as were the Fedders and some of the earlier Quiet Cool units. The superior cooling ability you notices was probably due to the lower units ability to extract more moisture from the air - usually the lower efficiency units extract more water because the smaller cooling coils must run at a lower temperature to get the same BTU rating. But they were also relatively immune to icing problems. Some of the more recent high efficiency units tend to have icing problems at low outdoor temperatures (below 70F) so a de-icing probe cycles the compressor to prevent an ice block from building up on the inside of the unit and plugging air flow. This limits the units ability to cool on those humid nights that are common in the NY/NJ area. In general, these old units were very conservatively designed and the makers had not yet discovered the art of specmanship. They were great, quiet machines that did their job well and lasted long.

It should be obvious now that noise level is an extremely important consideration in room air conditioners but also one difficult for consumers to judge before they buy. Opinions about individual products, not only from this forum but also in the wildly inconsistent user reviews on other websites, suggest serious problems in quality control during manufacturing. Therefore, CR should be buying several examples of each product or at least do a test on several examples of a few selected products to see if this inconsistency is real or just different users' expectations about "quiet" and "loud."

As for reporting decibels, this and other technical information on all sorts of products could be placed in a technical section on the website, available to readers who might find it useful and also available for longitudinal comparisons.

If you can't do decibels, just record the A/C operating at low and high, and drop the MP3 files here so we can get an idea of what's annoying and what's not.

Wow!  Brian - This is an inspired idea!   CR noise ratings seem so different from customer assessments of noise levels that your idea, paired with listing the sound in decibels, should provide very accurate information for the potential buyer.  Since everyone has different noise tolerance levels, as well as finding some noises more annoying than others, this combined info should be a great help.  CR, please listen to this man.