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Discussion: Outdoor grills > CR Doesn't Get It!
1 of 85

I just don't get CR when it comes to gass grills.  The categories you rate fall short of a complete analysis and some just don't make sense.  For instance:  Your rated category "grilling" is a rating of cooking in low heat.  First of all, this is counter-intuitive since grilling is something you do on high heat, so if I hadn't read the detail I would have been quite mislead by the scores.  If low heat is "grilling" then what do you do on high heat?  Why do you not grade grills on high heat performance?  Its as if CR thinks no one uses high heat nor cares about it.  Quite the contrary.  To me, the biggest problem with most grills is that they don't get hot enough and you end up with muddy colored meat with no searing.  Speaking of searing, the only way to truly sear is high heat ... go to Mortons or Ruth Cris and you will find out that 650 degrees is the surface temperature they seek to grill steaks "just right".  Why doesn't CR mention this?  If BTUs are not important then why haven't they come up with a meaningful benchmark that is?  How about surface temperature after a ten minute preheat on high.  That's what I want! 

People are always laughing it up at parties about the silly things CR cares about in their reviews.  No I want to add their utter ignorance of what is important in outdoor barbeque.  Get the knack!  Your reviews just aren't helpful.  I want my money back.

2 of 85
Another thing is they buy the units and use them as basically "new" but they don't "live" with them over years of service. Any imported POJ can cook fairly well out of the box but live with it as things fall apart and servie vaporizes like so much smoke and one can truly appreciate what Weber is all about. 15 hard years on my Genesis II and still going strong with original burners, ignitor, only one grate and flavorizer bar replacement. Cost of ownership? $500 purchase, $75.00 in parts / 15 years (do the math).
3 of 85

Completely agree. A few years ago, we ran out and bought the top rated Consumer Reports Vermont Castings grill. It performed terrible in colder weather and after a year started to fall apart. Finally, the burner controls broke.

Went back to a Weber unit and it has been flawless for two years (like our previous one had).

4 of 85

You answered you own question...high heat is searing; you can't cook much on high heat without it burning up.  High heat sears the meat to lock in the juices and I agree with you, CU needs to rate temperature at the grates after a 3 and 7 minute warm up with all burners on high.  I'd also like to see accurate useable cooking area - excluding the warming racks since most marketing include this in their number.  Grouping grills in small medium and large is a joke.  CU please spend more time analyzing the guts of the grill - I don't care about how thick the stainless is since I think a stainless steel grill is for those who want to look good, not cook well.

IMO the best grills out there are from Barbecue Galore and CU doesn't rate them because they are not sold at the big box retailers, only through their stores.  If you want high heat look into these grills you will not be disappointed.  I purchased my Captain and Cook 3 burner from them in 1996.  Yesterday I purchased their Turbo 4 burner since my three burner needs $80.00 in parts - cheap fix - but I wanted a bigger grill (780 Sq inches of cooking space) since the family has grown and BBQ Galore is discounting them by $350 this month...Personally I don't care for the Weber flavorless bars, I believe you get better vaporization with ceramic bricks which translates into more flavor.....but those Weber grills are always top rated - I'd like to see if that would change if CU throws in BBQ Galore products.

Edited 5/5/08   by  James_Virginia
5 of 85
Your BBQ Galore units are the same chinese imports sold at Sams bolt for bolt and not worth the $$$. Fell victim to one of these once but never again! It disintegrated in 18 mos
Message 18.6 was deleted
7 of 85

Larry-

Weber's entry line is from China as well......

My Captain and Cook is still going strong but when it was purchased it was made in Australia.  Several years back BBQ Gallore offshored to China so we will see how this new purchase holds up.  I decided to plunk down the $80.00 in parts and repair the old one and give it to my father.  His Weber Spirit just fell apart over the weekend after three years of ownership.  And yes, the Spirit is a Chinese product.

I'd probably consider purchasing the Summit by Weber but the vaporization design of the grill does not give off a lot of smoke which imparts the flavor.  My buddy has one and when you see the droppings hitting that porcelain metal flavorless bar as I call it, it runs off the surface very quickly and into the drip tray.  For a gas grill to impart flavor the more the drippings stay in contact with a hot surface the better the smoke and flavor.

Edited 5/5/08   by  James_Virginia
Edited 5/5/08   by  James_Virginia
8 of 85

I see NO such trouble. actually it's extremely difficult to tell the diffrence in foods I grill whether over my hardwood lump or on the Genesis. IMO those ceramic gimmicks cause way too much flare up and potential disaster.

The Weber is easy and simple to maintain and has cost next to nothing to maintain over 15 years. And yes the entry line of Weber is Chinese and what a crying shame that a company that builds such quality and supports it so well has to resort to this. It is criminal imo how much garbage comes from China and personally if I can do anything to avoid it (Chinese product) I do as I feel it's like sleeping with the enemy.

9 of 85

I think you are what we in the IT industry call a Troller.   You have no objectivity.  I queried your posts and I'm beginning to wonder if you represent Weber professionally.

You've purchased a lot of grills over the years according to your posts but you've had a Weber Summit for 15 yrs?  Why so many purchases if you're so dead set on the Weber and it has lasted you for 15 years?

 

10 of 85

I think you're VERY wrong here. I have NOT purchased alot of grills in 15 years only 2. My GENESIS II and one from Sam's club. The Sam's club was a nightmare and basically the same unit sold at BBQ Galore. In 18 months of ownership the unit disintegrated internally while the Genesis (NOT a Summit BTW) sits out and just does it's thing year after year with no trouble. I call that PERFORMANCE not schilling for Weber as you accuse.

If you want to have an intelligent non-accusatory discussion with me I'll play along if you don't than you not I are the troll

11 of 85

You state "Your BBQ Galore units are the same Chinese imports sold at Sam's bolt for bolt and not worth the $$$. Fell victim to one of these once but never again! It disintegrated in 18 mos."

Most every BBQ Galore-brand grill has a 5-year warranty on the grill, the burners, the cart, and the rest of the parts are covered for at least 2 years.  Knobs and vales have 1-year warranties. Their upper-end stainless ($1000 +) grills are often covered by limited lifetime warranties on most critical parts. If you had a BBQ Galore-brand grill that "disintegrated in 18 months", I hope you exercised your warranty options and contacted the store where you purchased it.

No, BBQ Galore-brand grills are not "the same Chinese imports sold at Sam's".

Many grill manufacturers and retailers, including Barbeques Galore, utilize the same Chinese companies to manufacture their grills. For consumers, this hasn't been a bad thing as grill prices have dropped and features have expanded since grills started coming in from China. Those manufacturers/retailers who have set high standards for their products and have built these standards into their design specifications, have continued to offer excellent quality products to their customers. Unfortunately, those manufacturers/marketeers who cater to the big box stores, with their "buy from the lowest bidder" mentality, have been forced to cut corners in order to compete. BBQ Galore-brand products are not sold in box stores and are not the same grills you'll find in Sam's, et al., even though they may have been produced in the same Chinese factory.

I agree with you about CR needing to reconsider some of its criteria for rating grills. High heat is important when you want to cook a steak. When you need heat, it has got to be there, and it shouldn't take all day for your grill to reach 600 degrees. BTU's are to grills, like horsepower is to automobiles and deserve to be rated.

Another thing CR needs to evaluate is the quality of the materials used to construct a grill. For example most box store "stainless steel" grills utilize low-quality, thin gauge steel. They may look pretty at first, but when they start rusting almost immediately, the old adage "you get what you pay for" should come to mind. The same holds true to burners and other critical parts. If you're unsure as the quality of the stainless, give it the magnet test. If the magnet sticks, it's lesser quality steel. if it doesn't, it higher quality and is less susceptible to rusting. IMHO a grille's quality can only be determined by surveying consumers after at least 5 years of ownership and use.

CU also fails to address one of the biggest problems consumers face with their outdoor grills, finding replacement parts. Just like everything else we own, grills break and parts wear out. When this happens, are parts readily available from the manufacturer/retailer? There are endless stories about consumers who bought a shiny new grill and 5 years later, when they needed to replace a burner or a cooking grid, found that the manufacturer has gone out of business, changed ownership, or no longer stocks parts for that particular grill. Would anyone buy an automobile if there was a question about finding parts to fix it later on? Should grills be any different? 

Finally, and I doubt if there is any way for CR to objectively measure it, but how does one evaluate customer service when something goes wrong with your grill? For example, when a grill part breaks or wears out when it's still under warranty, or even afterwards, who can call upon to make the necessary repairs? The manufacturer? You're on your own unless you buy a reputable grill, from a reputable retailer, who offers service and parts support. Getting a box of warranty replacement parts in the mail, even if you can get them, is only half the battle.

With outdoor grills now costing as much as a good used car, these questions are becoming  more and more important. I hope CR can find a way to incorporate them into their annual evaluation program.

In the interest of full disclosure, I have been employed as a salesman by Barbeques Galore for the past 3.5 years.

 

 

 

12 of 85

Not to come off like a jerk or anything but I looked closely at any possible differences between the Sam's Grill and BBQ Galore and IMO it was same pice for piece. As for Chinese imports being good for consumers....................how does that $4.00+ gal gas feel? We keep buying this stuff and as these other countries out compete us for this commodity our costs go up and our jobs go away. Sure you get to sell something but at what cost to this country.

 

13 of 85

Hey just wanted to say I'm enjoying the back and forth about Grills and where they are made I just hope we don't lose focus and go on down other topics and politics and away from discussing grills and what to look for in a good grill.

14 of 85

I"m trying not to but I wear the flag on my sleeve. Can't help it. When I see a statement of how imports from a coutry that has nukes pointed at us and whose sworn purpose of existense is to destry our own are "good for us" it just makes me see red and my blood boil.

Suffice to say at the time I bought my Sam's grill I investigated it against the BBQ Galore and it was identical piece for piece. It never dawned on me to look at where it was made. It truly disintegrated internally in 18 months. While it was whole it was not a bad unit. It actually was my grill of choice for steaks. As it seared just a little better and faster than the Weber. But that weber is still on my deck in one piece and with original burners, and ignitor, lights on first or second click, can still get parts if/when I ever need them, so yes it cost me alot when I got it. But........in that time I have spent nearly nothing on it. $500 (or whatever I paid that long ago) spread over 15+ years is pretty low cost of ownership if you ask me.

Rest assured because this is a rare weekend off for me I will spending much time making things for me and the family on it. And enjoying a wee adult beverage while doing this.

Salute!

15 of 85

Well just like clothing and electronics went overseas years ago now so goes things like most appliances, power tools, grills, and even furniture(some considered high end brands).   Hard for us to even vote with our pocketbook if everything we look at is made over there and we have no other choices.

Things I can suggest is to point out what goods are still produced domestically, what companies are still based domestically but manufacturing overseas, and what brands are completely designed and made overseas using just a domestic name to gain acceptance in the markerplace.    There's a number of consumers who will buy on price alone but there are also a group who want more than just a low price.  Not all domestic companies are wonderful either but it's nice to know who makes what and make an informed decision. 

I know someone who bought a certain brand grill saying he bought it because it's American made and the others he looked at were made in China.  I felt bad when I pointed out the made in China sticker on his new grill.  Now the grill has worked well for this person and no complaints so far but if part of their requirements were country or origin it would of been nice someone mentioned it to them (they even read the CR review and no mention of it).  Now the brand they bought is still a domestic based company but manufacturing product overseas.

Enjoy you're grilling this weekend.  I had steaks last night that came out pretty good and now off for more good backyard grilling.

16 of 85

I was in Home Depot the other day. Looking for a small portable grill for my kid. Hard to find the little Go-Anywhere from Weber. Anyway while in the store I overhear a rep speaking with a customer.

Customer has big shiny Cinese grill she bought from HD but insides have disintegrated.

She....I am looking for these parts. The outside still looks good but unit is not 3 years old and now I need all these parts.

He... Let's have a look. Hmmm seems we do not carry parts for this model any more too old.

She.... But it's a big shiny great to look at grill. I love to look at it but it does not work. What can I do?

He.... Let's go look at something else and proceeds to show her NOT the Genesis but some more big shiny junk she'll be in the same boat again in another 3 years!

It was all I could do to not laugh my rear end off or interject how she would only be "ripped" off again.

17 of 85

Yes I overheard a sales rep at Lowes talk about how Stainless Steel is the best and lasts forever.  Whoaaa even the best Stainless needs care and maintenance.

There is no EXCUSE for any company to make a grill and not have have replacement parts availalbe after only 3 years.  I know even some good grills have parts go bad within 2-3 years if they are treated poorly and in harsh weather climates but to not have the chance to replace is just beyond me.   Now if you said it was on the hundred dollar special grill, well half the time those are made to be disposable but on the "premium" stainless grills they should be livid with both the company who makes it and the store that sells it.

 

 

18 of 85

Larry,

There you go again! BBQ Galore grills are NOT the same ones you buy at Sam's Club and I question your technical ability to make such claims over and over again.

By your own admission, the grill that your purchased, which disintegrated in 18 mos., was a SAM'S CLUB product.  BBQ Galore didn't design it, didn't manufacture it, nor did we sell it to Sam's Club for re-sale. However, you use this bad experience to unfairly bash BBQ Galore products. How come?

Everyone who reads your posts understands that you are a big fan of Weber products. I am to, but Weber's are not the only high-quality grill on the market. There are lots of others. Just look at the CR ratings. There's lots of good grills out there. 

BBQ Galore may occupy a very small niche in the BBQ grill marketplace, but we probably work harder than any other grill retailer to satisfy our customers. After all, just how many retailers maintain a full-time service department, stock parts for their proprietary grills, and don't run and hide, or brush you off, when a warranty question arises? We assemble, deliver, install, and field test all our grills. How many other grill retailers can make this claim?

Like many Americans, I wish more of our consumer products were made in the USA. I am no more a fan of China than you are. However, when U.S. consumers decide that they'd rather spend $2K for an American grill, rather than $1K for a comparable product made in China, we'll continue to import Chinese products.

For those consumers absolutely committed to purchasing only U.S.-made grills, I suggest they consider Viking, Lynx, and Twin Eagle products. Unfortunately, the price of grills from these manufacturers usually start around $4K. If there any other all-American grills out there for less money, I'm unaware of them. Perhaps CR will point them out during their next grill review.

In the interest of full disclosure, I have been a salesman at BBQ Galore for the past 3.5 years.

19 of 85
We've been wanting to purchase a BBQ Galore charcoal grill after seeing it on Good Eats on the Food channel. We are in a state that doesn't have a store and so we're disappointed. We don't want to settle for another brand. Weber is good but the features of the Galore grill just outweigh the rest. And there's a good warranty. Harold - please let the company know you need a rep in Oregon!
20 of 85

I am going to respond to you and just this once. Unlike you I have nothing to gain by getting people to buy ANYTHING! You on the other hand get far more profit out of imports than anything else. Design and build? Common who you kidding here?! You send a spec sheet to China and they send you a product.

I have no personal gain either way. I will go out of my way to avoid anything made in China. I feel it's the civic duty of every person who truly cares about our country. Call me fanatical or anything else you like. All anyone has to do is look around at what's happening to this country and if they can't figure it out it's just too bad.

As for my technical ability? My own 2 eyes tell me everything I need to know.

Have a good day.

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